Sleeping Mestres
From: Acai da Holanda
Date: 28 Sep 2001
Time: 10:21:20
Remote Name: 195.121.176.80
Comments
Since a couple of weeks the girls in my group are irritated by my mestre's
behaviour. He has slept with several girls from our group. Most of the
women leave. He says it's a Brazilian thing to do. Personally I think you
should keep the relation student/mestre proffesional.My question to you
all is, how do you keep this relationship professional ? Do these things
happen in the U.S. or just in Europe and is this really a Brazilian thing
? Please respond, I've lost a couple of good friends and I do not wish to
loose more. Axe

Re: Sleeping Mestres
From: Anonymous
Date: 28 Sep 2001
Time: 13:20:15
Remote Name: 64.154.204.146
Comments
This is very typical. Happens all the time. It's not unusual in Brazil,
and is more "understood" and somewhat more socially acceptable than it is
in Europe or the US. Happens in Universities as well. The sexuality of
Brazilians appears to be more understood as a natural part of existance
than it is in Europe or the US (especially Protestant-based cultures like
most of norther n Europe or the US). While is is still considered
unprofessional and somewhat socially unacceptable in Brazil, it is
understood that this happens, and no one pretends that it doesn't like
they do in Protestant-based cultures. I don't think you're going to get
you Mestre to stop boffing his female students. If something happens like
if he gets Hepatitis (as happened to one of the Mestres in the Bay Area in
California), or something like that he may slow down. Chances are, though
it won't stop and there's nothing you can do about it. If it bothers you
that much, and you consider it to be your business, express your feelings
to your Mestre. Examine why you consider this to be wrong, though (is it
really?). If it is hurting the school from the business side, then that is
a very real, very pragmetic point you can make to your Mestre. Otherwise,
I'm sure he considers this to be one of the perks or the fringe benefits
of being a capoeira instructor. By the way, you can still be friends with
these female students outside of the academy. Take a step back from the
situation and analyze it. [And here my opinion may meet with disagreement,
and may be controversial, but I have looked at this many times and this is
my opinion - to which I welcome criticism] These female students would not
be "seduced" if they were not willing to be. Frequently, you have this
exotic Capoeria Mestre who is in great shape, and is capable of doing
amazing physical feats. He is friendly, and is in a position of authority
(which many women seem to see as an aphrodisiac - how many women said they
were willing to sleep with President Clinton?). When he shows them some
attention, and is flirtatious, these female students just fall like card
houses and carry on affairs with the Mestre (often despite the fact that
he may be married). Later when he does the same thing to another student
or when he stops showing them the same attention, treating the fling as it
was, just casual sex, these women are often somehow put off, and become
angry with the Mestre for somehow treating them badly. Women who go for
the Bad Boys of the world make careers out of being constantly burned when
in comes to sex and relationships. Here is a little story: One day along a
riverbank, a woman was sitting under a tree when a snake came up and
spoke. "Miss, would you mind carrying me across the river, I can't swim
and I would really like to get to the other side." The woman stepped back
and said "Are you crazy? You're a poisonous snake, if I carry you across,
you'll bite me, and I'll die." The sane replied "Aw, come on, I couldn't
bite anone as beautiful as you, and besides if I bit you in the river,
we'd both die, just carry me across, please." "Oh, alright." Said the
woman and picked up the snake and started across the river. When they were
half way across the river, the woman felt a searing pain in her arm as the
snake sunk it's fangs into her. "Oh!" she cried in dispair as she began to
faint into the water "You said you wouldn't bite me!" "Silly girl," said
the snake, "you knew I was a snake." This story is not meant to encourage
or condone the disrespect or maltreatment of others, but people must be
realistic. Frequently people know just what they are getting into, or come
from a point of making too many assuptions. Each of us is 100% responsible
for every choice we make and every action we make. The consequences of our
poor choices and actions can not be blamed on others.
 
 
 

Re: Sleeping Mestres
From: Corcaron
Date: 05 Oct 2001
Time: 23:24:58
Remote Name: 24.108.132.53
 

Comments
Hey it's been said a thousand times before "Capoeira and girls go hand in
hand"

Mestre Bimba even said "sleep with one eye open cuz a jelious husband can
be dangerious"

Seriously though it happens quite alot,maybe it's a brazilian thing who
knows all i know is with Capoeira it happens alot

 Teachers and relationships with students
From: Your scaly, smiling, swamp-dwelling friend whose hide makes a
fabuluous purse or wallet
Date: 01 Oct 2001
Time: 10:28:38
Remote Name: 65.105.119.178

From:
Date: 05 Oct 2001
Time: 12:26:55
Remote Name: 216.24.61.4
 

Comments
I think that if an adult student offers a teacher sex he should take it.
If the female is serious about capoeira she won't quit because of sex. I
don't think that it is wrong

Comments
I once had a conversation with a capoeira teacher who was known to be
sexually, uh, rapacious (not to insult anyone, but before I get knee-jerk
hate mail, please look the word up) on the subject of sleeping with one's
students. To my surprise, he was adamant in his insistence that this was
out of the realm of possibility for him. He explained it like this:
teaching capoeira depends on the maintenance of the hierarchy of mestre,
professor, contra-mestre, etc., and students. A sexual relationship
complicates the hierarchy by fuzzing the gradations of power. Suppose a
sexual relationship turned into something more -- how could you wield the
same command of a lover/girlfriend as you do a regular student? With a
significant other or even a simple lay, as it were, you have something
else invested in the person besides the development of the student and
perhaps their friendship (something else that should be understood
properly). He went on to say that while a friendship with a teacher can be
maintained by separating the two roles of the person (inside the academia
and at capoeira events, the person is your superior; outside, s/he is your
friend), sex has a way of not triggering emotions that refuse to be
confined to boxes.

This was the opinion of one teacher. It made me remember my first martial
arts teacher (my uncle, a karate instructor) who had an understanding with
his wife that she would not train under him -- they didn't want to bring
that very different relationship of teacher student into their marriage.
Obviously, not all martial arts teachers share this view, and I'm sure
that many of them make good on the situation -- I can think of at least
one mestre who has beat the odds, so to speak. I don't dare speak publicly
about the motivations or qualifications of your mestre, as that is not my
place to do so as a student (especially one who has most likely never met
your mestre), but perhaps this will be helpful to you.

- Your scaly, smiling, swamp-dwelling friend whose hide makes a fabuluous
purse or wallet

From: Your scaly friend again
Date: 13 Oct 2001
Time: 17:15:24
Remote Name: 65.105.119.178
Comments
respectfully, i think some of the last posters are missing the point. I
have no problem with people getting it on with other capoeiristas. My
opinion is that capoeira women are sexier than all get out, and basically
what I as man what I get to do in practice is play the equivalent of
martial Twister with some very fine bodies.

However, inter- and/or intra-academia lurvin' is one thing -- the dynamics
of power are another. Basically, think of it as the perennial
freshman-having-and-affair-with-her-college-professor dilemma. If you see
nothing wrong with that, then it's likely that you'll have no problem with
mestres getting it on with students.

- slither slither pad pad pad *quietly slip into the swap*
 

Re: Sleeping Mestres
From: Curious
Date: 24 Oct 2001
Time: 17:36:16
Remote Name: 66.80.46.243
Comments
Are you intimating your mestre is a ... ? And are others accepting this as
"normal" for Brazilians? Is this be a normal condition for studying
capoeira or associating with Brazilians? Do senior students inherit this
right to sample new students ... or is this reserved for the alpha? Should
this be stated in brochures along with other capoeira philosophies?

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